Mental wellbeing is an escalating global challenge having serious impact on the quality of life, productivity in workplace etc. Our approach to wellbeing fundamentally depends on our perspective of ourselves. Are we just human beings, not much different from animals or something more? Over thousands of years the Vedic spiritual seekers dived deep within themselves to explore the inner space and they repeatedly verified that we all, without exception, are in essence really spiritual beings having human experiences. Their discoveries form Vedanta philosophy - the 'science of human excellences" - which explain in detail and with much clarity how we have multidimensional physical, mental, emotional and ethical layers of personality covering the fundamental Pure and eternal spiritual being. Along with this, the Vedic seekers developed systematic Yoga techniques to purify our minds and "dis-cover" our true Self.
The Vedantic conception of ourselves and Yogic mind-management techniques offer an alternative approach to address the mental wellbeing challenges. Ramakrishna Vedanta Centre, Auckland has taken up a project to make available these Vedanta-Yoga teachings to empower individuals with the knowledge and skill-sets to better manage their minds, emotions, values etc. to live meaningful, peaceful and productive lives.
Ritam is the Vedic principle responsible for maintaining order, harmony and rhythm both in the macrocosm and the microcosm. Stress, tension, dis-ease etc arise when we lose this balance at different levels of our being and around us. We have limited capacity to influence change outside us but we can definitely integrate our mind to our inner Self to gain greater poise, balance and rhythm in life. Meditation is the art of turning the mind inwards and anchoring it to our eternal, omniscient, blissful and pure Self. The more we are integrated with our inner Self, the greater will be the influence we can cast around us. This is the spiritual way to freedom from the slavery to the eternal world and internal body, senses and mind.
Ritam - Being in Balance is our series of conversations with Swami Tadananda wherein we explore the Vedanta-Yoga teachings and practices to promote our wellbeing.
Swamiji uncovers the transformative potential of the four yogas—Jnana, Karma, Raja and Bhakti Yoga—when harmoniously integrated into everyday life. We draw insights from the teachings of Swami Vivekananda, illustrating how tasks such as teaching can evolve from simple transactions into meaningful spiritual engagements by embracing a holistic approach. Through the philosophy of Vedanta, we challenge the misconception of compartmentalized spirituality, demonstrating how knowledge, devotion, action, and meditation can enrich personal growth and service to others.
Swamiji shares practical wisdom for navigating tough decisions with empathy and transparency, while maintaining inner peace. Learn how to build spiritual stamina and willpower through meditation, viewing life's trials as opportunities for growth, much like exercises in a gymnasium.
Namaste to the listeners and Namaste Swamiji. How are you, swamiji?
Speaker 2:
I'm good, Sunil, how are you?
Speaker 1:
I'm good, I'm good. We've taken a pause in recording our podcast, but hopefully we'll be back on track. We've been really busy.
Speaker 2:
Yes, we had this opening of the Vedanta Retreat Centre and we were busy with the preparations. But now let us continue from where we left.
Speaker 1:
Today, swamiji, it would be good if we could try and synthesize the four yogas. So we've talked about Gyan Yoga, we've talked about Karma Yoga, we've talked about Raj Yoga, which is meditation, and we've talked about Bhakti Yoga. So we've talked about all the four yogas in detail, a lot, with all the different examples. But I think what will be really helpful for our listeners would be to understand how we can actually synthesize these yogas and actually use it in daily life.
Speaker 1:
So do we only do prayers? And if I, you know, if I'm a follower of bhakti yoga, so should I just, you know, go in front of the temple and light my devas and my pujas in the morning and night? And is that, is that it am, I, am, I, is it done? Or should I then also, with the remainder of the time you know, eight to ten hours that I get in between, or 12 hours that I get in between should I be active with some of some of the other yogas, or is it a strict policy? Is it a strict way, or are they watertight compartments or are they quite flexible in how we actually use them? So I think a discussion on that would be really helpful.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, that's a good idea, because we have discussed the theory part of it. But at the end of the day, it's only beneficial to us when we apply them and the more we can identify opportunities in our everyday life, what we call in the midst of our duties and responsibilities, the worldly life, as many people say. Sometimes we think in a way that the spiritual life is something different from what we do every day at our job and with our duties and responsibilities. But that's a misconception. I would say Life is life, it's one. Why should we break into compartments? And so, when we talk about this synthesis of yogas as preached by Swami Vivekananda, he tried to harmonize them, synthesize them, and the reason is that, look, we as human beings are one entity. We might say that we have emotions or devotion, we have intellectual capacity of the mind to reason, which then goes into the area of Jnana Yoga. Or we have hands and we are active, so that becomes action, or we might just become quiet and silent and be contemplative, and that is meditation. But really they are not like four water-type compartments, they are all one. It's just four perspectives, four approaches of that one being that we are. We are a holistic being and, as such, the best practice would be when we can put all those four elements in any one practice. Okay, so anything that we do, there should be elements of everything. It's like you mix up all the four items of food and eat together and you have the flavors separately. Otherwise, to give an example, if you have rice and three or four dishes, if you eat one by one, by one individually, it's not the same as when you mix it all up and get the taste of the fusion of the flavors in there. So how it can be harmonized? Well, in the Ramakrishna mission, the way we teach and practice the synthesis of yogas is through, powerfully, through the idea of service. But behind that service comes the knowledge part of I and the devotion part is there and the action part is there. All three are there, beautifully harmonized.
Speaker 2:
So let us take an example. You go to work, it's your duty. Suppose you're a teacher and a person who is not versed with the Vedanta knowledge would look upon the students as children there who parents have paid money to the teacher or to the school and they have to be taught some subject matter, and it's a very transactional thing. And after teaching the subject matter, the teacher thinks my duty is over, it's very. There's not any emotional connection deeply, it's just very transactional.
Speaker 2:
But when we bring in the Vedanta knowledge, then the light of that knowledge shows that. Then the light of that knowledge shows that every individual is really a divine being having a human presentation, the human expression of the body and the mind as they are conditioned by the culture and upbringing. But deep inside, behind all the waves, is that same ocean of consciousness. So that is the knowledge part that the teacher says seated in front of me are all these children, but really they are the divine in these forms. So that's the knowledge part. And the moment that knowledge part comes in there, then that child has suddenly become elevated to some worshipable being, because the divine is dwelling in there. It's not that I'm superior to that being. Actually now I'm lover and that person who is going to receive my service is higher. So Vedanta says do not stand up and give something and ask them to be grateful to you, but put them on that spiritual platform, kneel down and serve. Put them on that spiritual platform, kneel down and serve. So if that perspective change is produced is seen through the eye of knowledge, the Vedanta knowledge.
Speaker 2:
Then when the teacher is teaching to that child that offering of that knowledge, or trying to bring out that knowledge which is already in the child. That is the Vedanta approach. It's not. The child is an empty vessel and you are filling knowledge into it. No, it is that. The soul is of the nature of infinite knowledge, but some ignorance has blocked it and the task of the teacher is to remove those obstructions and the knowledge will shine forth. So that is the understanding, and the teacher approaches the child with great reverence, with love, and teaches. The best things come out of the teacher Great patience, great reverence, the full devotion. The teacher takes that. What was supposed to be a job, but now it has become. That work has become worship.
Speaker 2:
So the full emotional involvement has come. What that teacher might have practiced at home was to pour her devotion to the deity in the form of a statue or picture in her shrine. But here now those children are the living God and so again she has got an opportunity to practice in a more active environment, rather than communicating to a deity, a statue and a picture which is not responding, and the love and affection from the child and the response is so much more powerful than what happens in the private shrine. So you see that Bhakti Yoga has come in there, starting with the knowledge part, that which transforms the whole perspective and outlook that there's a divine in there. And now the emotional involvement has become of devotion and action, karma, which is the actual teaching, and everything the teacher that will do is your karma yoga. There it has become. It's not a work that I just do and I get paid for, but it is an act of worship of the Divine and whatever is the result of that work is offered to the Divine in that way. So the three yogas Jnana, bhakti and Karma have all become combined in that one exercise or activity which is teaching and learning in the classroom.
Speaker 2:
Now, yeah, okay, so it could be a parent taking care of the child, son and daughter at home, where you don't look upon them as a boy and a girl, but that infinite being that dwells in the heart of the substratum of the whole universe has come into my family as this child and all your work then becomes transformed into a loving act of bringing, giving affection and saving them with food and whatever other requirements. This work itself has become worship. That is the power of the synthesis of yogas. Where you can, you can spiritualize any activity, for that matter. Okay, and so it's not like okay, morning you do a little bit of spiritual practice and you come in the evening and do a little bit and the rest of the day is a worldly activity, which is a non-spiritual type of thing. No, with this philosophy of Vedanta, which Swami Vivekananda says practical Vedanta, making practical in everyday life, spiritualizing everyday life.
Speaker 2:
So what I'm sharing is one or two examples, but among the listeners there will be many who have different lifestyles and different professions and jobs and all that, and each one will have to reflect, using this example, how they would be able to apply that in their situation. It's good to go through that in detail situation. It's good to go through that in detail. So you run through your daily routine and say, okay, this is an opportunity for me to apply there.
Speaker 2:
The reason is that exercise is very useful is that when that actual opportunity of work comes anyway, because you have thought about it and you have sort of identified it, that idea will prompt up and say I had thought about it and you have sort of identified it. That idea will prompt up and say, oh, I had thought about it. Now. This is the time for me to jump into it and apply it. So this is if you're a doctor, your patients are God in front of you. If you're a businessman, the clients, the customers are God to you. If you are a whichever situation when you're dealing with people there, we see the divine in them all.
Speaker 1:
Right now to hold on what up just a question, um, so that's fine when you're just going about your normal day-to-day life and you're working and you, you know your colleagues sitting next to you and you maybe bring them a cup of coffee or just being nice and kind and and understanding, uh, often having empathy and all those things. But what if? What if? You know, some days you have to make some big decisions and big calls, or you know, you have in the news we're seeing all these manufacturing and paper plants and, for example, in kinleith there's a news item today that they're shutting it down. That will affect hundreds and thousands of employees.
Speaker 1:
So you know that's a news item today that they're shutting it down. That will affect hundreds and thousands of employees. So that's a bad thing to do, in the sense like we're laying off people and they will have no jobs and they might have to move out of towns and the whole economy might collapse in that small town. So how do you spiritualize a negative thing? It's a negative thing when you're shutting down and closing off and how do we sort of spiritualize those things?
Speaker 2:
so there are certain things within our control and certain things are not okay. So the interpersonal relationship definitely is in a control. You might have to take a hard decision but you still can do it with empathy, with, with understanding, rather than just being very cold and hard-hearted and and and hurtful. Okay. So it could mean that you'll have that conversation with your people in saying this is, these decisions are being taken and it's not that that particular the manager, whoever is going, he's making decision. It has come from the top management in the top management had to make a decision based on the financial position and all those type of things, or some government policies have changed. So many things could be there. But they explain to them nicely, listen to them. Maybe there could be opportunities to give them some other placement. So help them in some other way so that there is a transition that is not so hurtful and those people who are undergoing that hard decision understand it and there's not that much bitterness. There will be a little bit of hurt, there's a loss or something like that, but if you gently do this properly because you don't want to hurt the divine, that is in that particular form. When life is like this, you know, sometimes there will be wonderful successes and everyone will rejoice and enjoy and the pendulum will swing the other way and the hardships will come. This is what life is about, but in the midst of it we don't lose that deeper spiritual perspective of what we are doing. And so we'll still be able to do that. And you'll find that, both from the person who is taking the hard decision in this type of situation that you talked about, because it's not an easy job for that particular person also, you know, and they would be hurting, that they are forced to break this, make this tough decisions. But even with this approach, they can, you know, lessen the shock of those activities on themselves and on others also.
Speaker 2:
But so we talked about these three, four activities, you know, and sometimes people come and say, yes, it's all very nice to think that you know the divine dwells in the heart of being, and that is because we have studied Vedanta and we like it. But when we are dealing with those other people, they don't behave like God. Okay, all right, you know. So they might be harsh, they might be rude, they might be violent and, you know, indifferent or whatever is there, they definitely are not behaving as divine beings. Okay, so what do we do with that? Well, we will find that, yes, such situations do come, but they're not what happens all the time.
Speaker 2:
Most of the time you'll find good people around and you'll have enough opportunity to practice this when the situations are easier At home, within your close friends and with your people who are very near and dear. So those are the starting positions you know, and you'll need to develop that stamina, so to say, that capacity to be able to hold on to that idea even in the midst of difficult situations. That will come and they will come here and there and you might not be up to the mark in the beginning. You approach nicely and the other person got a bit rude and you reacted and things got out of control. And then later on you felt bad about it. But look at the end of the day, when you get back to it and understand that, oh, I tried to hold on to that idea but I slipped. Next time I'll be more alert idea, but I slipped. Next time I'll be more alert. How do I develop that stamina, let us say, or the capacity to hold on to that spiritual ideal in a difficult situation? That is where the meditation comes.
Speaker 2:
Okay, and meditation is when you really shut down all these others practices, but in a quiet, silent place. You develop that willpower by which you can hold the mind on an idea, the divine within you. And that same mind will be used in your workplace and you'll find that, in the midst of all those turmoil that might be happening around, one will have a greater degree of balance. And that's what being in rhythm, being in balance, is all about. Actually, the battlefield or the testing ground is not how nice and kind and gentle you are at home when no one is disturbing you. The real test is when you are out in the battlefield and see how you can maintain that balance. That is practical Vedanta, and that is why Shri Krishna, when he taught the, the Vedanta and the Bhagavad Gita is probably the best commentary on the Vedanta philosophy, because all the four Yugas are beautifully explained there.
Speaker 2:
And it's not taught to some monk sitting in the Himalayan mountain cave in a quiet, beautiful, silent place. It is taught to somebody in the battlefield. You know, imagine the tremendous action and energy and chaos that's all going there. And Shri Krishna is saying to Arjuna in the midst of all this, you have to maintain that balance. So we all have our own little battles at workplace here and there, and that is actually the place where this Vedanta is to be practiced. It's not easy, but it's not easy because we it might be, we are just the beginners in this now. You've heard of these ideas, might not have practiced it so far, but at least you have got an idea now that can empower you to be calm and collected and and not lose your balance and maintain, keep your sanity and make better decisions and be detached after the difficult choices and decisions that you make at work, that you are able to detach, offload when you come back home and and not carry it with you and let you disturb your sleep and your life. So this non-attachment and all those things come because Karma Yoga is about non-attached action. You are doing everything, but as an offering.
Speaker 2:
The result of that work is offered to the Divine because we are only instruments. We are not the real doers, the sense of agency. We are just one variable in a long equation. You know, in mathematics we write a long equation with so many X, y, z and everything there and then you solve it is equal to something In the complex world situation. The output is not totally dependent on one person. It is the decisions by the upper management, it's a financial situation person, it is the decisions by the upper management, it's a financial situation, it's the economic situation, it's depending on the whole group and everyone and in that we all sit as one small variable in there. So we should not take the credit if something to ourselves, if something wonderful, successful happens, and we should not also beat ourselves when something does not happen as per our wish. We accept that it's a much complex web and we are a small cog in the wheel and the wheel turns because some another wheel turns you in, another wheel turns that, another wheel turns that. So this is a complex machine and we do our best with minimum friction and the result is offered to the Divine which runs all the wheels together. So that type of approach or philosophy is karma, non-attached action.
Speaker 2:
But you do it with great devotion, not in a disinterested 5-8 way, I just do this for money only. No, you have to turn that into grease, it, lubricate it with the, with the, with this devotion in there, and you understand the whole complexity of the machine. What is behind the whole machinery, what is the power that runs through that and that is the Jnana part of it. And all that you get every day an opportunity to put into practice with your family at your workplace, wherever you are. But you have to reinforce and strengthen that through your meditation in some quiet place. Only then that you develop, put on that armor, so to say, and you'll be able to protect yourself.
Speaker 2:
And it's the undone repeatedly. Many times you'll go and you'll fall flat. Maybe you start the day and forget after sometimes and in the afternoon you remember. But if you're alert to that idea and every day is an opportunity, every complex situation is an opportunity, and you said, okay, I'm going to get into this, I'll get paid, this is my job and this and that. But this is a spiritual exercise for me also, and I'll test myself, how do I fare? And I hope that as I go through the year and go through life, I become stronger and stronger, more and more stable, and that's a wonderful thing. That work itself has become a wonderful spiritual work itself has become a wonderful spiritual workplace has become a wonderful spiritual practice. So that's what we talk about. It's the synthesis of yogas.
Speaker 1:
That's really good, right, because then you're not having to, you know, bound by just going to temples and shrines and whatever not, you actually are spiritualizing everything that you're doing, and it's a day, on a daily basis. So it's people you meet, it's at home, it's at work, it's everything that you do. So that's what the four yogas yeah, that understanding of the four yogas makes it quite clear. It gives you a good template, a format. Obviously, we need to act upon it. As you say, we have to keep reminding ourselves that this is what to do when and what to say when, and sometimes you have to just pause and bite your lip because you might say things that you know that would be instinctive to you, but you know, now that you have some knowledge, that you shouldn't be. This, you know, saying this in this way should be said in a different way, in a different tone and a different temperament. Uh, so as to achieve the in a different tone and a different temperament, so as to achieve the outcome, but in a better way.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, you have a spiritual outcome from what could be a very transactional, mundane, everyday responsibility If one did not have this philosophy. He just goes out and works and earns money and he's happy with that and of course the world affects him also. But now, with this Vedanta perspective, suddenly every piece of work has become an opportunity for advancing one's own spiritual progress. You still get your salary and all those things, but you get something more salary and all those things, but you get something more. And that reminds me when Swami Vivekananda was in America and preaching Vedanta and all that, he ran into this famous person, ingersoll, robert Ingersoll, who was an agnostic and he was also a preacher travelling around America. And one day, when he met Swamiji, he said oh, swami, you know, agnostics say what's the proof? There is God. Here's this world. I can see a touch taste, you know, it's real for me, I experience it. What you talk about, the Atman Brahma, god, it's not something visible and experienced. So why bother yourself all those things? And he said to Swamiji so it's alright, you know I am a realist, you know, down to earth I'm a practical man. And he says give an example, this world is an orange. You know, I now want to get the maximum juice out of it, so I will squeeze it nicely, that's it, make the best of it.
Speaker 2:
And, unlike any other spiritual teacher, maybe in Vedantin, who might have said oh, this is all, maya, it's false and it's a dream and this, and that Swamiji did not say anything like that, he said yes, you're right, you know, this world is an orange if you want to say, but I know of a better way to get and how to squeeze and get more juice out of it. Okay, how to squeeze and get more juice out of it, okay. So we don't deny, but you get something more. We don't say to go, don't go and work, do all those things, enjoy, but there is a something more. You can get out of the activities and duties of life and say, why not? This Vedanta knowledge gives you the technique to to extract more out of life, not only in a material sense, but something spiritual out of it also.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, yeah, that's good. I mean, I've got a quote which I was reading recently, and this was during a visit to the NASA Space Station in 1962. President Kennedy noticed a janitor carrying a broom. He interrupted his tour, walked over to the man and said I'm Jack Kennedy, what are you doing? The janitor responded I'm helping put a man on the moon. Mr President, see, that's a very good way of looking at it, right? Otherwise you'd say that you're doing a very menial job. You know, cleaning, just being a cleaner. But you know, it feels like he's spiritualized the whole thing right, saying no, I'm doing much more than that.
Speaker 2:
I'm helping put a man on the moon, because he knows if he doesn't do his job well then someone else is going to be affected by this, and then, and so it goes right, he's a cog in a bigger machine. So yeah, and all cogs have to move, the bigger one and the smaller one. Only even a single one that is not in place can unsettle the whole thing.
Speaker 1:
See, yes, yes, that was pretty good. Thank you so much. I think that's very good. On the synthesis of the yogas. Is there anything else you'd like to add?
Speaker 2:
Well, I think you know, after hearing all these things, what would the listeners do. It would be a good exercise, you know, to reflect on these things from their own, from the perspective of their own everyday life. I'm a monk, so I see the world in my own way. You, you are a professional and you husband and a father and all that you are seeing another way. Different people live in different situations and sometimes it's just good to go through your, you know start, okay, how does the day start and how does it roll forth and and the end, and then weekends come and months come and years come and say, okay, where are the opportunities for me? Let me write down where I can apply this Vedanta teaching, and you can.
Speaker 2:
You can think that it will make some difference in what you're doing and it's important to identify that. So you might say there are 10 cases and next time when I'm doing an interview or I'm talking with my subordinates or I'm teaching, whatever I'm doing, I'll be a bit mindful to apply this there. If you don't think like that, that opportunity will come and it'll slip by and you'll miss it. But because you have sort of pinned it down with a red flag, when it comes, that idea will also come. Oh yes, you have to be able to grab it at that moment. So if you identify it and mark it, just like we mark when a computer put a flag in there, that flag will remind you this is the opportunity to apply that. So I think that's the exercise one can do.
Speaker 2:
And and then at the end of the day or at the end of the week and said, okay, how many times during this week I could apply that Vedanta? And you say, wow, that is, I applied two or three times, you know, and what was the difference? And that's when you begin to get a taste of this philosophy. It's not just some understanding, but it's actually practical. And the more alert you become, vigilant you become, you'll find that so many opportunities come.
Speaker 2:
That's why Swami Vivekananda says this world is a gymnasium where we come to do exercises to become spiritually strong, wonderful way to look at life. It's a gymnasium that so many tools are there and all are there to help build up our stamina, physical stamina, and actual gymnasium. But in this world gymnasium there are all these tools to make ourselves spiritually strong, but we have to identify and know which tools are there, otherwise we just, you know, lift and put them down and feel the pain, not understanding and getting the strength out of it. So that's my suggestion, and listeners can test it out and find out for themselves how it works for them. Thank you, sunil.
Speaker 1:
In the next episode we will look at bringing in new topics. Thank you, swamiji.
